The new user interface is in preview!

Want to check it out? Click here! (If you don't like it, you can still switch back)

League Forums

Main - General MFN Discussion

Defense

By ZootMurph
8/29/2013 9:07 am
The passing game is too easy. Not enough bump and run coverage, and the players play way too far off, in many cases.

I'd like to be able to choose the distance a coverage guy is off of his cover assignment. I'd also like to be able to choose whether there is bump and run coverage.

A perfect example of why this is needed is 3rd and long. If I blitz on 3rd and long, then I want to be in bump coverage, to slow down the routes and give my pass rush more time to get to the QB. When the coverage is 10 yards off, then they do an in route, make the catch, and with minimal players in the secondary (because of the blitz), it's an easy first down. I don't mind getting beat there with the proper coverage, but you can't blitz because of poor coverage, and you can't play man or zone because there isn't enough pressure on the QB, and eventually SOMEONE will get open.

Another issue I have is the perfect pass. I see this too often. A guy is smothered in coverage, the ball is thrown to him, and he makes the catch. Yes, this happens in real football, but not as often as in this game. It may seem to happen often, because of Sportscenter and all the other news shows which only show highlights, so you see these great plays all the time. But, in this game you see this many times in a single game, every game. If there are 8 of these in a real NFL week, it is a big week. I'm not saying it shouldn't happen, but it is my opinion that this should be reduced a bit.

Finally, defensive players chasing down a QB who is out of the pocket. I've mentioned this before, but I've been seeing it all the time. The QB is forced out of the pocket. He is 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage and stopped near the sideline. All the pass rushers are 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage chasing him. They run parallel to the line of scrimmage, run past the QB, then turn around. I understand that they are trying to take an angle, but first he is not moving, and second, he is in the backfield and should not be considered a runner, but a passer, so they should always take a direct route towards him when there is no blocker between the pass rusher and the QB. I really feel this needs to be changed.

These issues make passing overpowered. Making adjustments would make it more challenging to pick the right players and right plays for those players to be successful on offense, and would also add more challenge to defense, in defending the better play selection. I've tried many different defenses (I'm in all 5 leagues, so I get a lot of chance to test), and nothing, even with VERY good players, can really stop the passing game.

Re: Defense

By outlawedz
8/29/2013 9:54 am
something i noticed is the path the de are taking. they seem to always go inside, they never rush to the out side. If they were to rush more towards the outside it may stop the qb from running to the side line every pass play.

Re: Defense

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
8/31/2013 7:09 am
I appreciate everyone's suggestions for defense/playcalling ideas - I plan to have a roundtable discussion to try to get the ideas together and organized, some great ideas floating around and I want to make sure the best solutions get implemented.

This would be a significant enough update that it will certainly be in the 0.2 version. I still have a handful of issues that I need to deal with in the 0.1 version before it's locked and I feel like I can start on 0.2, so please continue to think about how you'd like the updates to play out, what makes intuitive sense to you and what you think would be the best way to present it without being overwhelming for the user who doesn't want to take advantage of it, and you can feel free to continue to discuss it on the boards here - just know that I probably won't participate in the discussion until I'm ready to start thinking about the design and implementation of the ideas.

Re: Defense

By ZootMurph
9/07/2013 5:43 am
Case study... MFN-2.

11 games into the season, 2 QBs already have over 4000 yards passing.

Re: Defense

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
9/07/2013 7:41 am
ZootMurph wrote:
Case study... MFN-2.

11 games into the season, 2 QBs already have over 4000 yards passing.


Those QB's completion percentage and yards per attempt look ok to me, which makes me wonder if the # of pass plays they are calling is a factor (both have an average of 40+ passes per game, which is on the high end but not necessarily way over the top).

Does anything else about their stats jump out to you as being abnormal that would be contributing to inflated numbers?

Re: Defense

By ZootMurph
9/07/2013 4:17 pm
First, I think you and I will have to disagree there. 74.5 completion percentage is NOT OK. Add to that the fact that there are half a dozen QBs that will BREAK the all time passing yards record on their current pace. Also, why is everyone passing so much? The answer... because it's too easy. No one with over 350 pass attempts completed over 70% of their passes.

Second, look at the top 14 QBs in passer rating... ALL over 100. 15 if you count the guy that has 1 pass attempt, LOL. In 2012, there were ONLY 4 QBs over 100 QB Rating with over 350 pass attempts.

Finally, the top 11 QBs in the NFL last year had over 4000 yards. We already have 2, and we'll have probably 2/3 of the league over 4000 yards this season. 2/3 of 32 is more than 11 :)

More stats:

2011: 4 over 100 QB Rating, 10 over 4000 yards passing, 1 QB over 70% completion rate.
2010: 4 over 100 QB Rating, 5 over 4000, None over 70%
2009: 5 over 100 QB Rating, 10 over 4000, 1 over 70%.

I can go on, but I hope you get the point. Passing is too easy, so everyone is passing too much. ****, I like to run the ball, but I'm starting to pass more also. It really needs to be modified, and the passing effectiveness needs to be reduced. If MFN-2 is any indication, passing is overpowered. And, as such, it will also be overused and abused.

Re: Defense

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
9/07/2013 5:33 pm
I spent some time trying to get completion percentage up in the 50-60% range, it resulted in some QB's getting in the 70's. You're right, that's too high - I need to look into this further. I have a couple of other tickets in the passing game, I may see if any of them seem to impact the completion percentage. The trick is to get those 70's down into the 60's without dropping the 50's into the 30's like they were before. I might also need to penalize the passing game if you pass too much - there already is a small penalty, might need to make it more significant.

I'll push this issue up the list and play with it next.
Last edited at 9/07/2013 5:34 pm

Re: Defense

By nero
9/08/2013 6:12 am
Jon,

I think this goes back to something I asked you a while back regarding play scouting. If you remember I had inquired as to whether scouting a play that was a CB3 blitz would impact a non-scouted CB3 blitz using a virtually similar package and you said no.

I think that if scouting also affected similar plays instead of just a specific play you'd find that passing would settle a bit.

Re: Defense

By ZootMurph
9/08/2013 9:35 am
jdavidbakr wrote:
I spent some time trying to get completion percentage up in the 50-60% range, it resulted in some QB's getting in the 70's. You're right, that's too high - I need to look into this further. I have a couple of other tickets in the passing game, I may see if any of them seem to impact the completion percentage. The trick is to get those 70's down into the 60's without dropping the 50's into the 30's like they were before. I might also need to penalize the passing game if you pass too much - there already is a small penalty, might need to make it more significant.

I'll push this issue up the list and play with it next.


I agree with what you've said here. I also think that if a team does too much in one area during a game (throwing 50 times a game, for example), the defense should become more aware of the play call and more effective in stopping it. That will also slow down team's that are passing far too often.

Re: Defense

By ZootMurph
9/08/2013 9:49 am
Also, I just want to be clear. I don't want one thing to be overpowered. I love defense, but I don't want this to be a defensive game, where every game is 12-6... I also don't want one way of playing to be the 'only' way, where in 6 months every is using virtually the same type of gameplan and same type of players. Many games I have played, and some I still play, evolve in this direction... FOF and GLB are two examples.

I hope this game can become a game where many different strategies can be effective, and where there is balance in the game.

Finally, I have been told countless times that I come across as arrogant and abrasive (among many other things, LOL). I apologize to any that I offend, I just don't know how to be any other way :) My intentions in all my posts are to help improve the game, from my point of view. I understand I am not always right. Basically, what this paragraph is saying is this: Please don't take offense at things I say or the way I say them. :D